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 My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill

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FrogSage

FrogSage


Join date : 2011-12-30
Posts : 32
Age : 27
Location : Soul Society

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PostSubject: My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill    My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill  EmptySun Jan 15, 2012 10:40 am

Today's Two Cents is about my predictions Post ORCS. (Order of Chaos)
All of us (Or the overwhelming majority) have heard about "Wind Up Inzecters" being able to clear your opponents field and hand. Ordinarily, this would make a very good deck. However, inzecters being DARK and insect type makes them vulnerable to the common side decked 'anti dark' cards (Shadow Imprisoning Mirror, etc). Inzectors, being insect type, mean they're vulnerable to cards like 'Insect Barrier' (Neither player can summon insect type monsters) Not to mention inzectors being very inconsistent. Wind ups are quite the same, few being the same type/attribute meaning they're vulnerable to Gozen Match and Rivalry of the Warlords. Also, I have tested Wind Ups and they NEED two monsters on the field in order to function. That being said keeping monsters of the field will win you the game. Despite this being said, I'm expecting many "Inzecter Up" decks at National this year. Thats why my Deck of Choice next format is Dark World Skill Drain. (Depending on the ban list) because Inzecter ups field/hand kill combo can be stopped easily via Effect Veiler. Skill is like a permanent Veiler.
I don't see Inzectors as a threat because of their vulnerable type and attribute, and fragile consistency. Wind Ups take a huge amount of skill to play, especially pre ORCS, and as we all know, skill is something of fairytales. (Although some YGO players are actually quite skilled, even with auto pilot decks) However I've seen lots of Auto pilot Deck players simply repeating moves that they saw "top players" make without knowing why. Skill is achieved through experience. Some achieve real skill after just a few months. Some a few years, but many players get discouraged when they lose and quit before achieving skill. It took me a couple years before I actually knew why and understood how the game works, and why certain moves were made. Most of the people at my Local remember when Ronintoadin was first released, and I entered tornament with a Frog beatdown deck, and continually came in finals. I, however, at the time, wasn't really a good player. I didnt know why, I just made the moves I did. Skill takes time. Took me about 2 years I think. Other longer, other less. Wind up inzectors will take skill outside of their looping to clear hand/field.
Thats my Two Cents!
Thanks for Reading!
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FrogSage

FrogSage


Join date : 2011-12-30
Posts : 32
Age : 27
Location : Soul Society

My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill  Empty
PostSubject: Oops   My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill  EmptySun Jan 15, 2012 4:26 pm

Sorry
Where I said 'skill is like a permanent effect veiler'
I actually meant to say 'Skill Drain is like a permanant effect veiler'
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MutG
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MutG


Join date : 2011-06-06
Posts : 583
Age : 30
Location : Cape Town

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PostSubject: Re: My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill    My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill  EmptySun Jan 15, 2012 7:34 pm

Once again, good job! Except this time I got some criticism:

- Inzectors are actually pretty consistent. Depending on your build, the deck can be ready to take advantage as early as the first turn and easily possible in the second turn too. There are many plays which the deck can use in order to achieve the "two card combo" that it needs.

- Wind-Ups can be good, but like you somewhat said, it's not going to do as well. The main problem with the deck is that very fact which you mentioned: it has to have those two monsters. But more-so, the deck can easily be stopped with side-decking. This leads me into my next point.

- Inzectors, game 1 can be really powerful and it's most likely to win its first game depending on what the opponent plays or is playing. Game 2 and 3, for me are similar. There are three types of duelists: a rookie, a great duelist, and a duelist that knows the game better than the creator of the game. (yes, believe it or not, there are duelists out there who are!). The latter of the three types of duelists will be able to read what the opponent is going to be side-decking into and will be able to take that to his/her knowledge and win the rest of the match from there. It's simple logic: You, a Dark World player will know, especially. Your opponent is most-likely going to side-deck Shadow-Imprisoning Mirror for you and you can side-deck against that and use it to your advantage. And like I said, any superb player will be able to side-deck against those cards that could possible hurt Inzectors in game 2 and 3.

- On the last note, it goes about "Auto-Pilot" decks. Do people know what this really means? It means going herpderp into this and then that - exactly what Agents do. Their move is to summon Gachi Gachi and follow that up with Hyperion and Kristya. Many might say Gadgets is also auto-pilot and to some extent I agree with them. There is only that much you can do with the deck. Let's take a look at the decks that made top 8 at our most recent tournament: Dino Rabbit can be auto-pilot, I agree, but that's only when you go herpderp into Rabbit first turn and then get Laggia/Dolkka. But how often does that really happen? You can work that out. It's highly unlikely. Then Dark World as well. People will also say it's auto-pilot because herpderp Grapha destroy your back-row, summon it and attack. Rinse and repeat the summoning of Grapha. But there are those times where you not going to do that. But you can save your deck's own behind! Onto Agents, which I already cleared and said it's probably the most auto-pilot deck of the format. There is almost no thinking involved when playing the deck. Onto Zombies. Not auto-pilot. A little bit yes, but not as much as the aforementioned decks. Machina Gadget is also very auto-pilot. It's herpderp summon Gadget or Machina and activate Solidarity and set Solemn Warning to your back-row. Frogs is also somewhat auto-pilot, depending on your build. It's herpderp summon Gachi Gachi and Sea Lancer. Salvage back and repeat. But then again, it doesn't always happen and that's what allows it to be less auto-pilot. Gladiator Beasts to me, honestly is also auto-pilot. Summon GB, set 4 back-row because I have herpderp Solemn Judgment. Or summon GB and set 1 back-row. Karakuri is also herpderp. Summon Synchro and control or swarm. Plants is not auto-pilot. Similar to Zombies.

P.S: If I offended anyone, shame. Then you shouldn't be playing the game because you cannot take criticism. Go make card tricks using your common cards.
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Sabbaticus
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Sabbaticus


Join date : 2011-06-08
Posts : 59
Age : 37
Location : Pretoria

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PostSubject: Re: My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill    My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill  EmptyMon Jan 16, 2012 9:27 pm

You keep saying every deck is inconsistent, and I have to disagree. Both decks are pretty damn consistent unless you're a poor deck builder, or otherwise inexperienced. The problem being that Wind-Up loop with Hunter is more vulnerable to disruption than Inzektors. Sure you can side against them, doesn't make them bad decks. You can side against any deck, which is why you also side/counter side. But Inzektors are amazingly consistent and against top tier decks including Dino Rabbit, and also raping Agent variants. It also has the advantage over Wind-Ups of not being hurt by Maxx "C" which Plant Synchro usually mains 2 copies of, since you will only special summon once to do all you need to do, so it's pretty devastating to plants too. Dark World is far more inconsistent and takes a very skilled build and pilot to break free from that consistency issue. I would go so far as to say that running Dark World for competition sake at Nationals would be a great gamble.
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MutG
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MutG


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PostSubject: Re: My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill    My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill  EmptyTue Jan 17, 2012 2:03 pm

I'm sorry. When you said that about Dino I had to comment. Dino first turn into Dolkka = good game. pretty much. Rabbit doesn't have to commit to the board and can re-summon Dolkka whenever they want to rendering Inzectors useless.
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FrogSage

FrogSage


Join date : 2011-12-30
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Age : 27
Location : Soul Society

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PostSubject: .   My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill  EmptyTue Jan 17, 2012 4:22 pm

Firstly, thanks for reading.
I have proxied inzecters against one of my friends (after I wrote this, i wrote this on a couple ones I saw).
They are actually quite consistent. Most inzecter players, like dark world players, will counter side.
Dark World has proven semi consistent for me. Probably cos I built it in such a way to draw as quickly as possible (3 reckless greed, scarr, 3 dealings, 3 upstart etc) Bad hands happen, but not too often. Maybe once or twice per 5 round Torny.
I have to agree with you both on the consistency of inzecter, due to them being dark makes them easy to side against, however, also gives them access to a wealth of support.
I never said wind ups were inconsistent. Their weakness lies with the vulnerability and '2 monster' need. I like inzecters in terms of what they get around (maxx c as you mentioned, and d fissure)
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Sabbaticus
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Sabbaticus


Join date : 2011-06-08
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PostSubject: Re: My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill    My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill  EmptyTue Jan 17, 2012 6:04 pm

Of course going into Dolkka turn 1 (presuming you open with Rabbit AND go first) would kill Inzektor... at least it would if most Inzektor decks didn't main 2-3 copies of Fiendish Chain. So game one you'll go into Laggia since you don't really know what you're up against, then you'll loose that duel unless you opened with your best possible hand of Rabbit + Tour Guide and have 2 copies of your normal monsters in the deck. Then duel 2/3 Inzektor sides and counter sides, still maining 2-3 Fiendish Chain as well as 1 card Laggia/Dolkka killers. So yeah Inzektors give Dino Rabbit a hell of a time. I think it's one of the best contenders against that deck post ORCS.


Last edited by Sabbaticus on Wed Jan 18, 2012 1:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
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dragonite
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dragonite


Join date : 2011-04-11
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PostSubject: Re: My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill    My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill  EmptyWed Jan 18, 2012 11:58 am

First up I don't agree on what is auto-pilot. Take a look here to see what I think about that.

Secondly the topic has two disparate components which should rather be discussed seperately (unless it's the one wrt to the other).

Finally on the post-ORCS meta. There are only three competitive decks to come out this booster:
Wind-Ups
Inzektors
Ninja

The first 2 have some very advantage gaining plays which is very powerful but play out in different ways. Inzektors very much seek to gain advantage of the board and create card advantage through control thereof. Wind-ups don't allow for a player to sit back and slow the tempo of the game as they have access to the hunter loop and generic Xyz to gain advantage. I haven't really looked much at Ninja's but they seem very interesting.

I don't know how much of an impact it will have on the meta locally though as very few players will actually manage to pick up these decks.
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MutG
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MutG


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PostSubject: Re: My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill    My Two Cents: Post ORCS Meta and Time Taken to Gain Skill  EmptyWed Jan 18, 2012 1:43 pm

Sabbaticus wrote:
Of course going into Dolkka turn 1 (presuming you open with Rabbit AND go first) would kill Inzektor... at least it would if most Inzektor decks didn't main 2-3 copies of Fiendish Chain. So game one you'll go into Laggia since you don't really know what you're up against, then you'll loose that duel unless you opened with your best possible hand of Rabbit + Tour Guide and have 2 copies of your normal monsters in the deck. Then duel 2/3 Inzektor sides and counter sides, still maining 2-3 Fiendish Chain as well as 1 card Laggia/Dolkka killers. So yeah Inzektors give Dino Rabbit a hell of a time. I think it's one of the best contenders against that deck post ORCS.

Still don't agree with you at all. Laggia still messes their play up, and I HIGHLY doubt a deck such as Inzectors will have enough Inzectors in their hand to go off again in the following turn. You saying what if Rabbit doesn't open into Laggia etc? Same goes for Inzectors.
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